12-10-2016 4:16 PM
Police dog Finn was stabbed by a 16 year-old, He's now recovering but a petition has been started calling for Police Dogs and Horses to be given the same status as Police Officers. Fancy signing the petition?:-
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/168678/signatures/new
Here's the info (The number of signatures is out of date, it's over 31,000 now) :-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-37621671
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-03-2018 8:42 PM
The latest:-
https://news.sky.com/story/hero-police-dog-finn-to-receive-george-cross-for-animals-11290900
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-06-2018 9:58 AM
Goodness me, things they are a-changing?:-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-44487214
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-06-2018 4:41 PM
It looks like it's been blocked....... again!
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-06-2018 7:56 PM
05-07-2018 8:23 PM
Another Police dog's been stabbed and the Bill is back before Parliament tomorrow.
https://news.sky.com/story/police-dog-stabbed-three-times-in-domestic-incident-11427050
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
06-07-2018 10:30 PM
The Bill got its second reading today:-
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-44738507
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
06-07-2018 11:14 PM
Sentimentally (and CD, you'll probably remember that I've a real soft spot for German Shepherds) - sounds good.
Realistically - why do we continue to put these wonderful creatures in harm's way? They've no idea of what's likely to go wrong until they're knifed/shot/whatever. They're not heroes. They're loyal and uncritical companions doing what they're told to.
The ghastly little toerags villains they are set upon are, like it or not, responding instinctively to an attack. I also hate saying that, but it's a fact. But I'd imagine any new law would find itself challenged pretty quickly.
In any case - of what possible comfort could it be to a stabbed dog that the nasty who perpetrated the villainy will now be subject to more serious sanctions than previously?
Goodness knows what the answer is. A dog can be so much more effective than a person in some circumstances, and might well save that person from even worse injuries than any which occur - but that's still because the dog was placed in harm's way, not because of any heroic impulses.
To suggest that a service dog is any more deserving of legal protection than any other simply makes no sense to me.
If we're genuinely concerned about animal welfare, perhaps it's time to revisit the whole notion of using police dogs.
07-07-2018 10:41 AM
The dogs are in the front line to do what their handlers can't do. That is to find and detain those who have failed to stop for the police, (whether that's the handler or other police). In doing their job, they deserve the protection of a higher sanction just the same as other police officers.
If an offender has already "stopped", he (it's always a "he" isn't it?) won't have the dog "set upon him". He'll be ordered to remain still until other officers can detain him. At that time, the dog will be restrained on a leash.
If he resists and attacks the police officer, the dog will respond.
However, if an offender has run away and the dog is sent off the leash to find him, the dog will attempt to detain him until the handler arrives to call the dog off.
It's usually in the ensuing time between the dog detaining the offender and the handler catching up that an offender will attempt to harm the dog.
Harming the dog is just the same as harming (assaulting) a police officer so the dogs deserve the same degree of lawful protection as that of other officers.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
07-07-2018 2:26 PM
As you say it is the time between the person being caught by the dog and the arrival of the dog’s handler when any harm is likely to come to the dog. Harming the dog is NOT the same as harming an arresting officer - first the dog has no power of arrest nor can it even conceptualise such an idea - secondly the dog will continue to assault its ‘victim’ until its handler arrives.
Finn’s law would make it an offence for a totally innocent citizen attacked by a police dog to harm the dog whilst trying to protect themselves - (the proposed law removes the defence of ‘self-defence’.
Logic dictates that the intent behind attacks on police dogs is not to harm the dog but rather self-protection. Totally different from those individuals who hurt animals just for ‘fun’.
In your opinion would the guy in this report be justified in hurting the dog in question.
07-07-2018 3:30 PM
As with all incidents of "self-defence", reasonable force is justified.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
07-07-2018 3:59 PM
‘Finns’ law removes ‘self-defence’ as a defence against attacks on police dogs.
07-07-2018 4:04 PM
No-one would argue with "reasonable force". Using a knife isn't reasonable. Story, end-of.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
07-07-2018 5:13 PM - edited 07-07-2018 5:15 PM
@cee-dee wrote:No-one would argue with "reasonable force". Using a knife isn't reasonable. Story, end-of.
Why wouldn’t a knife have been reasonable in the situation linked to? What about a brick or a stick?
The reason for Finn’s Law removing the self-defence argument was because many individuals attacked by police dogs used It successfully to avoid conviction.
In the following situation nobody was charged with any offence - I’m surprised that as the attack took place in a travellers’ camp the dog wasn’t knifed.
https://www.travellerstimes.org.uk/news/2017/09/police-dog-attacks-traveller
07-07-2018 7:08 PM
I hope "travellers" never descend on Deno's fields.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
07-07-2018 8:32 PM
I might be more worried about police dogs visiting.
07-07-2018 8:34 PM
You've never had travellers near you to experience the mess and destruction then?
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
07-07-2018 10:15 PM
What on Earth has that to do with police dogs?
Or are you suggesting it justifies an unlawful attack on the travellers?
07-07-2018 10:47 PM
It was you who introduced "travellers" in to a thread about Police dogs at #93.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
08-07-2018 1:29 AM
No - I introduced a link to a situation where I believe that the person attacked had every right to use force against an attacking police dog - a right that would be removed if Finn’s Law came into force.
You appear to be suggesting that somehow an attack by a police dog would be justified because the victim was a traveller.
08-07-2018 9:44 AM
I'm not suggesting that, I'm suggesting "reasonable force" is as justified between a dog and a man as between a man and a cop.
You're not a "traveller" who's "settled down" are you?
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.