Authenticity Guarantee programme - good idea?

[paul*tribesandvibes*]

I'm not a seller of watches, sneakers or handbags, but when I read the ebay blurb about this new programme, my first thought was, 'will the Buyers be patient enough to wait for the proceess' ? I mean, will ebay add more delivery time on to a listing knowing that it's going to be sent to who-knows-where for who-knows-how-long? Buyers get pretty antsy when items dont arrive on time. Was wondering if anyone had been through this. Thoughts?

[rsm1309]

People are clearly put off by this. I've had items at a decent price with a high number of watchers sitting unsold for months. I know from 20+ years experience on EBay that these items would have sold in the past.  I don't know why EBay feel it necessary for long term sellers with good feedback and no previous authenticity issues.  They could be far more selective who this policy applies to.

[mrskptuk]

I'm not sure it is a positive, actually no its not! Recently I purchased two bracelets and they failed authentication as they had French hallmarks, not surprising given they are from a French designer and none of their items is going to have a UK hallmark. I ended up purchasing these outside Ebay as they were coming unworn with original box, ribbons, bag and receipts - far from ideal but I had no doubt these were authentic given the niche brand.

[ojewellery]

@mrskptuk  I know your post was a couple of months ago but something else came up today that reminded me of it.

France, although the originators of hallmarks some 800+ years ago have chosen not to sign up to the reciprocal hallmarking convention to respect the hallmarks of other countries within the agreement.

Until Brexit we had a different bit of legislation which existed in addition to the hallmarking convention, the Houtwipper agreement, basically those countries within the EU agreed to acknowledge each others hallmarks.  Post brexit there is no such agreement and so French hallmarked gold can't be sold as gold in the UK - UK hallmarked gold can't be sold into France.  How we feel about that is something else.  Its very men in suits posturing.  We both know deep down we've happily traded gold for hundreds of years.  We're still in the bitter post divorce phase and not behaving like grown ups.

The countries within the hallmarking convention are: Austria, Croatia, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Denmark, Finland, Hungary, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Serbia, Slovak Republic, Slovenia, Sweden, Switzerland and UK.

Denmark means all the lovely hallmarked current and historic Georg Jensen pieces should pass through authenticity. 

Italy joining (late to the party in December 23) means the very high percentage of fine metal chains in circulation can legitimately be sold.  People like to knock online trade in jewellery as being somehow less legitimate but the biggest UK high street chains use Italian chain makers and I'm confident haven't post Brexit changed to getting UK hallmarks on all their chains (bulk of world manufacture is Italian).

[wesleymews]

I've just had a Hermes bag returned as 'not able to be authenticated ' from eBay. It's not one of their popular bags it's called a Market Bag. I bought it some 25 years ago and the quality of the gold fittings, Hermes Made in France logo on the bottom, and Hermes stamped on the underside of the buckle are all as you would expect. In those times Hermes  did not date stamp all its items. So annoying. The market for this bag would not have been big enough for someone to fake, and certainly not 25 years ago. 

[rsm1309]

My item - successfully authenticated by the authenticator - never made it to the buyer.   I have no idea whether the authenticator failed to send them on, or the fact they were being mailed from a (known?) authentication location made them an attractive target to the courier.  Or whether they arrived safely but the authenticator did not use a tracked/signed method and the buyer thus tried it on.  Anyway, that was nice - my first and only experience of Ebay authentication resulting in me having a claim made against me.   Ebay did follow up saying 'ignore this' but honestly, I wouldn't use the system again.  Not after that.

[wesleymews]

Well after this experience I won’t be selling any other Hermes or expensive bags on eBay. I have a very rare Hermes Maxibox box…I very much doubt that the Authenticator would have ever seen one…why would I risk sending it to an address I can’t be sure of. It was bought in Selfridges about 8 years ago, I possibly have the receipt but would they accept this, and reading some of the other responses would they send that receipt back to me? Someone lost theirs through sending to the Authenticator.

‘I’ve been 40 years discovering that the queen of all colours was black’ Renoir

[bittyboy101]

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@rsm1309 wrote:

My item - successfully authenticated by the authenticator - never made it to the buyer.   I have no idea whether the authenticator failed to send them on, or the fact they were being mailed from a (known?) authentication location made them an attractive target to the courier.  Or whether they arrived safely but the authenticator did not use a tracked/signed method and the buyer thus tried it on.  Anyway, that was nice - my first and only experience of Ebay authentication resulting in me having a claim made against me.   Ebay did follow up saying 'ignore this' but honestly, I wouldn't use the system again.  Not after that.

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I always thought that this whole authentication thing was a bad idea and now I can see why thanks for confirming this... It looks like the item was lost or stolen somewhere between eBay and your buyer... and of course eBay are pro EVRi (Hermes) so we all know what they are like sometimes ! 🤔🙄

My money's on the courier losing or stealing the parcel... That's why sending anything to eBay for them to authenticate it is a bad idea because after this you are not in control of what service eBay use on your behalf to deliver your sold item to your buyer safely... it just says "we send your authenticated item to your buyer using a tracked service."  Tracked service = EVRi/Hermes !!!! 😞 and NOT RECOMMENDED FOR VALUABLE ITEMS with their track record !! 🙄   

[bittyboy101]

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@wesleymews wrote:

I've just had a Hermes bag returned as 'not able to be authenticated ' from eBay. It's not one of their popular bags it's called a Market Bag. I bought it some 25 years ago and the quality of the gold fittings, Hermes Made in France logo on the bottom, and Hermes stamped on the underside of the buckle are all as you would expect. In those times Hermes  did not date stamp all its items. So annoying. The market for this bag would not have been big enough for someone to fake, and certainly not 25 years ago. 

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You are now basically it the mercy of eBay and their inexperienced authenticators !

Time to jump ship ! as this one's going down fast !

[wesleymews]

Interestingly I bought a Hermes Maxibox bag from Selfridges about 8 years ago for £5500 , I have receipt and I’ve just checked it has no date stamps or any stamps just good quality fittings and H on the zips. And Hermes Paris Made in France. So I wonder what they would make of that!

‘I’ve been 40 years discovering that the queen of all colours was black’ Renoir

[bittyboy101]

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@wesleymews wrote:
Interestingly I bought a Hermes Maxibox bag from Selfridges about 8 years ago for £5500 , I have receipt and I’ve just checked it has no date stamps or any stamps just good quality fittings and H on the zips. And Hermes Paris Made in France. So I wonder what they would make of that!

‘I’ve been 40 years discovering that the queen of all colours was black’ Renoir

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God knows !...

All I can say is I'd rather you than me !  That's a pretty expensive/valuable item. Be careful. 

[hill876]

This validates my concerns! I just sold a high-value Breitling watch and when I printed the shipping label it said Ruislip (some warehouse) and not Blackpool where the buyer lives. I got their address and sent it DIRECTLY to the buyer. I packed the watch with a LOT of care, including all authentication certificates. My concerns are that it adds delay, might very well go missing and they for sure won't repack it as carefully as I did. I now have to prove delivery to eBay before they get a manager to release the funds manually. 🙄

[wesleymews]

Youre lucky you managed to find their address just hope eBay pay out. I sold my bag privately through a trusted resale site , no problem from them, although I wd have got more from eBay. I probably should have resorted to Vestiaire. L.

‘I’ve been 40 years discovering that the queen of all colours was black’ Renoir

[pg_kicks]

Don't want to alarm you or anything but your buyer can just claim he hasn't received a watch and get his money back and keep the watch. 

Wasn't you but eBay don't use Evri, they push it on sellers but they know themselves it's terrible so use DPD and FedEx for authentication items, they are uneducated on many things but they know not to trust Evri.

[papso22]

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@hill876 wrote:

This validates my concerns! I just sold a high-value Breitling watch and when I printed the shipping label it said Ruislip (some warehouse) and not Blackpool where the buyer lives. I got their address and sent it DIRECTLY to the buyer. I packed the watch with a LOT of care, including all authentication certificates. My concerns are that it adds delay, might very well go missing and they for sure won't repack it as carefully as I did. I now have to prove delivery to eBay before they get a manager to release the funds manually. 🙄

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You absolutely should not have done that!  Your watch had to go to the Authenticator centre for authentication and then they send it on to the buyer.

By sending to the buyer direct you avoided the checks that ebay promised the buyer they would do (via the programme and link on your listing), and also sent it to an address other than the one that ebay gave you. The latter invalidates seller protection.

I really hope you get your money and there are no issues with the watch, but you have made things complicated by making up your own rules.

[bittyboy101]

Good to know that eBay do not use the dreaded EVRi (MyHermes !!!)

I still don't like this Authenticity Guarantee programme idea and think its best not to sell anything on eBay that requires the Authenticity Guarantee programme to be used before the item reaches your buyer as the less people that handle your sold item  the more chances of it reaching your buyer... intact/complete...   

[pg_kicks]

Have you ever used it? It sounds very much like you havent, I cant comment on jewellery as its not my categories but for sneakers its much better, it covers the worries (for the buyer) of me selling fake items, if a person returns it worn eBay instantly reject it, if its lost in transit both me and the buyer are instantly refunded as eBay self insure and for the time it takes on average it gets to the buyer in the same time period as if I were to send on tracked 48 (which 99.99%) of my none authentication items use. 

The hallmarks and the bag issues sound like they need better training or clarity on but thats training, the framework of the process is pretty good, obviously a few tweaks would help like bulk shipping but on the whole its a positive addition.

[4_bathrooms]

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@hill876 wrote:

I just sold a high-value Breitling watch and when I printed the shipping label it said Ruislip (some warehouse) and not Blackpool where the buyer lives. I got their address and sent it DIRECTLY to the buyer.

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Was it the buyer's idea to bypass eBay's authentication service?

By doing what you have done you have left yourself with absolutely no protection whatsoever should the buyer open a case for any reason.

[bittyboy101]

No, I've never actually used it but I have read up and researched it.

Whilst it might seem like a good idea in some respects, it also has a negative side of delaying the whole transaction (many buyers will indeed be put off by this delay)  Also there is no guarantee that the buyer will receive the same item that you have sent, as it only takes one mistake or a dishonest person to mix up or swap items and you and your buyer will then have a problem !

It's bad enough having to post a valuable rare item and worry that it makes it safely to your buyer, let alone the worry and stress that someone else will actually open your parcel and maybe steal the item if it takes their fancy... or some clumsy person might accidentally open the parcel the wrong way and drop some of it's contents on the  floor obliviously and then repack it and send it on to your buyer incomeplete...

Sorry, I don't feel 100% comfortable with this and would NEVER sell anything on eBay that invoves this procedure.   

[pg_kicks]

Sorry dont think you read my comment or have actually read up on it.

With regards to the delay, there isnt a delay, the EDD is shown on ebay with it in mind, mine probably say they will get it between 28th and 1st if they buy today, in reality they will get it 99% of the time 28th so the very first day. 

If they switch it they basically have to remove your item and tag a totally different item, that tag has a chip in which says what the item is, so if they tag a pair of Adidas when I sent a Nike the buyer just opens a return and both me and the buyer are refunded. I've sold thousands and this has happened once when the buyer got a pair of LV shoes, worth more than what he bought but obviously not what they wanted, they were refunded within 24 hours. As long as you return the item with the tag attached you are fine, you got to be a bit silly to remove the tag on a damaged or incorrect item.

If you have any other worries I'm more than happy to clear them up for you, training may be needed for hallmarks and older bags but thats the same for all of these companies, its still better than no checks.

[bittyboy101]

Most people who buy expensive small items like to receive their items by Next Day fully insured delivery, eg Royal Mail Special Delivery or DPD etc.

If I was buying a wedding ring today and getting married this Friday I most certainly wouldn't want my ring to arrive on 28th Oct to 1 Nov !!! - Seeing that, I would think this is no good and jump in my car and drive over 4 miles to town where I can buy my wedding ring from a reputable place and come home with it the same day in the box with the guarantee and receipt.

As a seller I wouldn't want to be mucking around with special tags and labels and then have the delayed worry of painfully having to wait until eBay says everything's OK, or my buyer leaving their feedback to let me know they are happy.

I am old fashioned and like things to be straight forward and simple.

Buyer buys and pays and I just pack and post via next working day fully tracked and insured post.

Non of this faffing around with tags and unwanted delays which could destroy a seller's reputation of a quick and reliable service.