topic Re: What if? in The Round Table

What if?

cee-dee — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 10:28:15 GMT

OK, so no-one wants to argue any more but what if.........................

A couple of years back referendum was called about either staying in or leaving the EU and the majority voted to leave. Since then arguments have raged back and forth and the remainers are agitating for another referendum.

What if they had another vote and this time the result was to remain BUT, then the leavers started agitating for another making claims for this, that or the other? Would the remainers claim "We had a democratic vote so that's that, we remain IN".

We had a democratic vote before though? The result of that was to LEAVE so if a second vote went the other way would any notice be taken of leavers wanting yet another?? If not, why not?

Shouldn't a vote on something be IT as regards any result not a cause for those who didn't like the result to agitate for another? Where does it end?

By that reckoning it could result in a parliamentry vote for a constituency which ended in a close vote for one person then having those opposed to then claim it was "close" so they demand another go? How many "go's" do you want?

Re: What if?

right-then-petal — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 10:43:07 GMT

Just The One, Leave

Re: What if?

right-then-petal — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 10:58:35 GMT

And If There Was A Second Vote And It Went The Same Way As The First Would That Be The End Of It All

Re: What if?

mikes*corvettes — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 11:43:26 GMT

There wasn't a second vote back in 1975...So why should there be one now.

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 13:53:04 GMT

But CeeDee...when we voted, we didn't know what we were voting for!😏...as these sour grapes losing Remainers like to claim. If they want to use that argument, then the same goes for the vote in 1975..the British public were well and truly hoodwinked then. The referendum two years ago was a binding vote..a democratic vote. And there shouldn't be another one. The democratic result and wishes of the majority of the British people have to be respected..in a proper manner. If it isn't...there will be big trouble in this country.

Re: What if?

cee-dee — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 14:06:58 GMT

All points well made.

I voted NO in 1975 and then voted to leave, since then I've not changed my mind.

The EU want us to remain in, now why's that do you think? = Same reason as all the illegals want to come here, they want to keep on robbing money from us.

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 15:09:55 GMT

They want us to remain because the EU is on very shaky ground. If we obtain anything remotely resembling a good deal for ourselves, then other countries will want the same. The EU is a long term, long planned organisation, and it depends apron all members following the same rules. No one country can be favoured, or it will begin to unravel. I voted 'No' in 1975 too CeeDee..I smelled a rat even then. My OH voted yes, because he worked for British Steel...and big things were promised. And look what it did for British Steel..who made the best steel in the world. It was decimated, and is now practically non existent. I hate the EU with a passion...and that disgusting star strewn flag. Whenever I see rows and rows of that blue monstrosity, it reminds me of how the Nazis used to fly rows and rows of their Black and red Swastika flags..same idea, just a different colour flag.

And as for the recent immigration problem..you can trace that right back to the Euro-Mediterranean Pact of Barcelona in 1995...all planned and agreed. And the British people were never told about it or consulted. Not that it would have made any difference...

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 15:14:24 GMT

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 15:15:52 GMT

Re: What if?

cee-dee — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 18:22:32 GMT

Astro, I think those two points should be rammed home to every remainer in a way that they'll never forget.

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 18:44:56 GMT

The powers that be all know, CeeDee..but they have all already sold their souls to the Devil to be in that disgusting club. The ordinary man in the street probably doesn't know because it has all been quietly engineered and kept from the British people. And the media has been controlled in order to just tell us what they want us to know. And our children have been brainwashed into believing how wonderful that organisation is...and any dissent is swiftly silenced.

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 18:48:42 GMT

Re: What if?

upthecreekyetagain — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:28:06 GMT

Why no complaints about the General Election held in 2017, just two years after the “people had spoken”?

Why no complaints about the Labour Party calling for another General Election.

People change their minds all the time - why shouldn’t we have another referendum, especially as the first one was only ‘advisory’?

Re: What if?

astrologica — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:51:39 GMT

Advisory? I don't think so. It says..'The Government will implement what you decide'. This is the leaflet that came through everyone's letterbox prior to the referendum. Nowhere does it say 'Advisory'. Democracy in action.

Re: What if?

upthecreekyetagain — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:55:28 GMT

I don’t understand why so many are against a second referendum no matter what.

The first referendum showed what the majority of people wanted - to leave the EU - nothing about under what conditions.

Would those who voted to leave all be happy with a deal that kept the UK in the single market and customs union with free movement of people? What about an agreement to abide by all EU directives? Would they be happy with continued payments to the EU budget but no representation in the European Parliament nor Council of Ministers where decisions on how and where that money was to be spent?

That was the problem with the referendum, a ‘yes/no’ answer couldn’t express the true “will of the people”.

Parliament quite rightly is going to have a vote on any deal negotiated with the EU - likely to be held in November. If a ‘deal’ with Brussels is rejected by Parliament then in March next year we will leave the EU with no concessions being offered by either side.

It makes perfect sense to me to find out if the majority want to leave under those conditions. It may well turn out that the majority still want to leave.

Re: What if?

upthecreekyetagain — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 21:59:40 GMT

@astrologica wrote:
Advisory? I don't think so. It says..'The Government will implement what you decide'. This is the leaflet that came through everyone's letterbox prior to the referendum. Nowhere does it say 'Advisory'. Democracy in action.

Yet another lie spouted by one side or another in an attempt to get people to vote the way they wanted them to.

The European Referendum Act 1915 was the Act of Parliament that made the legal provision for a non-binding referendum to be held.

Re: What if?

fallen-archie — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 22:01:41 GMT

Isn’t it normal for the opposition to claim that the only option is an election, how much does it cost every time we have one? In my experience conservatives look after the pennies while labour give them away until they are worthless! That is not to say that there aren’t significant flaws in the current governments ability to serve up a decent Brexit deal, but then the EU has always made it clear that the U.K. would not benefit from its departure, they are very upset at our leaving and it is understandable, despite the fact that the French never wanted us in there in the first place! I am sick to death of listening to and reading stories about Brexit, I believe we will ultimately be better off as a nation by departing, and that Europe ought to embrace our wishes and make life as straightforward as they can as they all owe us a significant debt! It seems sad that they are unable to acknowledge the contribution of Britain to the European project and to allow us to continue as a sovereign nation state with close bonds! I am not an enemy of Europe I simply wish to see us making our own laws and funding our own essential services.

Re: What if?

upthecreekyetagain — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 22:05:06 GMT

You may well believe that we will be better of out of the EU - I don’t know either way and cannot make a considered judgement either way until we know under what terms we will be leaving.

I don’t believe we will be better off however unless we can come up with a sensible deal on trade, borders and regulations.

Re: What if?

upthecreekyetagain — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 22:07:08 GMT

PS in the above post the date of the Referendum Act was 2015, not 1915! 🙂

Re: What if?

fallen-archie — Sun, 30 Sep 2018 22:17:10 GMT

I agree with you creeky, but if we continue to be bad mouthed by the EU and remainers here where is the motivation to give us a good deal, the answer is that there is not one, It is up to us to paddle our own canoes against the tide if necessary, we have done it before and we can do it again!