topic Re: Flying lessons!!! in The Round Table

Flying lessons!!!

charliebird123 — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 00:11:38 GMT

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/tyneside-taxpayer-money-paying-ethiopian-6266510

As far as i know libraries and swimming pools are being closed on Tyneside because of cuts,if that is so this seems ludicrous.Mags,Pete heard anything about this?

Re: Flying lessons!!!

blackburn_stevie — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 02:06:11 GMT

I saw that earlier on Tuesday and thought it was so mad that it just had to be a wind up. Still, thinking about it a bit more, anything is possible considering the loons that are governing this country at the moment.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

the-geezer — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 08:00:43 GMT

Good innit, our son Brian has to pay for his lessons!

Re: Flying lessons!!!

upthecreekyetagain — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 08:39:37 GMT

Aren'r they just receiving student loans ?????

Re: Flying lessons!!!

the-geezer — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 08:57:06 GMT

Not as far as I know, be nice if HE could, but then again, he was born in this country.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

dailyscare — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 10:47:04 GMT

When this guy qualifies he'll be able to fly Cameron,Clegg and Milliband to India and put them on tha rocket to Mars,also paid for with our money.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

bankhaunter — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 11:43:41 GMT

It would appear to be a simple case where the council wished to determine whether or not Section 23CA of the 1989 Children's Act would apply to those young people in their particular situation.

It's the law which determines to whom any particular legal right applies to, not opinion.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

ronnybabes — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 13:49:37 GMT

@bankhaunter wrote:
It would appear to be a simple case where the council wished to determine whether or not Section 23CA of the 1989 Children's Act would apply to those young people in their particular situation.

It's the law which determines to whom any particular legal right applies to, not opinion.

but I accept that there is some grey area about how this applies to asylum seekers. As a councillor, I want to know who authorised this particular legal action and who will be held accountable.”
A city council spokesman said: “This case is based on a novel and complex aspect of law which we felt it important to clarify. The courts have now clarified the position and we are bound to abide by their ruling.”

That still desn't top it from being bonkers.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

upthecreekyetagain — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 14:06:23 GMT

Bonkers that two young men abandoned at the ages of 11 and 12 should be provided with student loans by the council which was responsible for their care or bonkers that the government says they must leave the country next year and therefore aren't eligible for a loan via the government sponsored scheme?

Re: Flying lessons!!!

ronnybabes — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 14:26:51 GMT

Both ! ! and then some more.....

Re: Flying lessons!!!

*.*..lola..*.* — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 15:45:30 GMT

I totally agree that it's bonkers, Ronnie - Newcastle council have just had £9 million cut from their public services revenue. Put simply, at this point in time, they have much more important things to spend their money on!

I'm shocked that some people seem to think that the needs of this one person are more important than the needs of many.

If my son decided that he wanted to be a pilot and asked me for £10,000 to pay for flying lessons, as much as it would be kill me, I would have to tell him sorry but there is no way I could ever afford to raise that kind of money..even as a loan.

Unfortunately, that's life and we don't ALL get everything we want in life - why should this lad be any different just because he is an asylum seeker?

Re: Flying lessons!!!

bankhaunter — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 17:21:43 GMT

I'm shocked that some people seem to think that the needs of this one person are more important than the needs of many.

They don't, the requirement to fund the further education of those in care applies to all those in care going on to approved education.

The two in question were in care and qualified for the support, that qualification was tested in court, they were not treated any differently from others who were in care.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

upthecreekyetagain — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 18:42:44 GMT

@bankhaunter wrote:
I'm shocked that some people seem to think that the needs of this one person are more important than the needs of many.

They don't, the requirement to fund the further education of those in care applies to all those in care going on to approved education.

The two in question were in care and qualified for the support, that qualification was tested in court, they were not treated any differently from others who were in care.

Actually they were treated differently - if they weren't on notice to leave the country next year then the loans would have been supplied by central, not local, government.

Perhaps the question that ought to be asked is why two people that have lived here since they were 11 or 12, been cared for by the local council and educated to a good standard are now going to be sent out of the country to somewhere else in the world to live.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

bankhaunter — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 19:10:39 GMT

The local authority provides the support for care leavers until age 25.

http://www.careleavers.com/acessingeducation

As to your second point, one can only presume that the authorities were unable to deport them as children though it does make you wonder if it was going to happen, why not when they reached 18.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

upthecreekyetagain — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 22:03:29 GMT

@bankhaunter wrote:
The local authority provides the support for care leavers until age 25.

http://www.careleavers.com/acessingeducation

As to your second point, one can only presume that the authorities were unable to deport them as children though it does make you wonder if it was going to happen, why not when they reached 18.

At university level students apply for a loan in the same way as eveyone else for fees and other expenses although there may be additional support in the form of bursaries and grants from the localauthorities - see your link

"You will be able to apply to a Government service called Student Finance Direct for Tuition Fee and Maintenance Loans to cover your living costs for more information see www.studentsupportdirect.co.uk .You have to repay your loans in small instalments once you start earning. "

It was this route for finance that was denied these two individuals which is why the council have to provide the loans.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

ronnybabes — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 23:20:58 GMT

As I said - "Bonkers"

Re: Flying lessons!!!

charliebird123 — Wed, 06 Nov 2013 23:26:32 GMT

Ronnie......Double bonkers!!

Re: Flying lessons!!!

margaret*e — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 08:35:33 GMT

Bonkers indeed, not only flying lessons to be paid for, but court costs for them and the council, how many more services to be cut?.

The winners in this case will be the lawyers.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

bankhaunter — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 09:01:40 GMT

Not bonkers at all, it is sometimes necessary to test whether or not certain laws cover certain situations, it happens all the time and the ruling will affect similar situations in the future for all local authorities.

It's part of the legal process in the UK. just isn't often reported and it's such actions which give ordinary people many of the rights they now enjoy, the law is for everybody not just for people we like.

Re: Flying lessons!!!

*.*..lola..*.* — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 10:46:31 GMT

This is the lad's own side of the story:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/giving-the-other-side-the-story-behind-the-asylum-seekers-flying-lessons-that-caused-fuss-in-the-daily-mail-8924391.html

I must admit that I do feel a little bit chastened now although I'm slightly confused by this statement:

He did well enough to get a pilot training place at Buckinghamshire University, but turned it down because the fees were £160,000 once flying lessons were included, and he felt bad charging the council such high sums. “I chose a different route because it was cheaper to do the pilot licence first, then go to university to do the rest,” he says.

If you factor in the cost of the court case and legal fees etc he hasn't actually saved the council any money at all so why did he turn down the original Uni placement he was offered? Something doesn't add up for me there?