https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3273423#M128253 <P align="center">Restorative</P><P align="center"><STRONG>Power—Jehovah</STRONG> <STRONG>Is</STRONG> <STRONG>“Making</STRONG> <STRONG>All</STRONG> <STRONG>Things</STRONG> <STRONG>New”</STRONG></P><P align="left">A CHILD loses or breaks a beloved toy and lets out a plaintive cry. The sound is heartrending! Have you ever seen, though, how a child’s face lights up when a parent restores what was lost? To the parent, it may be a simple matter to find the toy or even to fix it. But the child is all smiles and full of wonder. What seemed to be gone forever has been restored!</P><P align="left">2</P><P align="left">Jehovah, the ultimate Parent, has the power to restore what his earthly children may view as hopelessly lost. Of course, we do not mean mere toys. In these “critical times hard to deal with,” we have to face losses that are far more serious. (2&nbsp;Timothy 3:1-5) Much of what people hold dear seems ever at risk—home, possessions, employment, even health. We may also feel dismayed when we contemplate the destruction of the environment and the resulting loss, by extinction, of many species of living things. However, nothing hits us as hard as the death of someone we love. The feelings of loss and powerlessness can be overwhelming.—2&nbsp;Samuel 18:33.</P><P align="left">3</P><P align="left">How comforting, then, to learn about Jehovah’s restorative power! As we will see, there is an amazing scope to what God can and will restore to his earthly children. In fact, the Bible shows that Jehovah purposes the “restoration of <EM>all</EM> <EM>things.”</EM> (Acts 3:21) To accomplish this, Jehovah will use the Messianic Kingdom, ruled by his Son, Jesus Christ. The evidence shows that this Kingdom began ruling in heaven in 1914. (Matthew 24:3-14) What will be restored? Let us consider some of Jehovah’s grand acts of restoration. One of these we can already see and experience. Others will occur on a large scale in the future.</P><P align="center">The</P><P align="center"><STRONG>Restoration</STRONG> <STRONG>of</STRONG> <STRONG>Pure</STRONG> <STRONG>Worship</STRONG></P><P align="left">4</P><P align="left">One thing that Jehovah has already restored is pure worship. In order to grasp what this means, let us briefly examine the history of the kingdom of Judah. Doing so will give us thrilling insight into Jehovah’s restorative power at work.—Romans 15:4.</P><P align="left">5</P><P align="left">Just imagine how faithful Jews felt in 607&nbsp;B.C.E. when Jerusalem was destroyed. Their beloved city was shattered, its walls torn down. Worse still, the glorious temple that Solomon had built, the one center for pure worship of Jehovah in all the earth, was left in ruins. (Psalm 79:1) The survivors were taken into exile in Babylon, leaving their homeland a desolate haunt of wild animals. (Jeremiah 9:11) From a human standpoint, all seemed lost. (Psalm 137:1) But Jehovah, who had long foretold this destruction, provided hope that a time of restoration lay ahead.</P><P align="left">6</P><P align="left">In fact, restoration was a recurring theme in the writings of the Hebrew prophets. Through them, Jehovah promised a land restored and repopulated, fertile, protected from wild beasts and enemy attack. He described their restored land as a veritable paradise! (Isaiah 65:25; Ezekiel 34:25; 36:35) Above all, pure worship would be reestablished, and the temple would be rebuilt. (Micah 4:1-5) These prophecies gave the exiled Jews hope, helping them to endure their 70-year captivity in Babylon.</P><P align="left">7</P><P align="left">At last, the time of restoration came. Freed from Babylon, the Jews returned to Jerusalem and rebuilt Jehovah’s temple there. (Ezra 1:1,&nbsp;2) As long as they adhered to pure worship, Jehovah blessed them and made their land fertile and prosperous. He protected them from enemies and from the wild beasts that had overrun their land for decades. How they must have rejoiced in Jehovah’s restorative power! But those events represented only an initial, limited fulfillment of the restoration prophecies. A greater fulfillment was to come “in the final part of the days,” our own time, when the long-promised Heir of King David would be enthroned.—Isaiah 2:2-4; 9:6,&nbsp;7.</P><P align="left">8</P><P align="left">Shortly after Jesus was enthroned in the heavenly Kingdom in 1914, he addressed the spiritual needs of God’s faithful people on earth. Just as the Persian conqueror Cyrus freed a remnant of Jews from Babylon in 537&nbsp;B.C.E., Jesus freed a remnant of spiritual Jews—his own footstep followers—from the influence of a modern-day Babylon, the world empire of false religion. (Romans 2:29; Revelation 18:1-5) From 1919 onward, pure worship has been restored to its proper place in the lives of genuine Christians. (Malachi 3:1-5) Ever since then, Jehovah’s people have worshiped him in his spiritual temple—God’s arrangement for pure worship. Why is this important to us today?</P><P align="center">Spiritual</P><P align="center"><STRONG>Restoration—Why</STRONG> <STRONG>It</STRONG> <STRONG>Matters</STRONG></P><P align="left">9</P><P align="left">Consider the historical perspective. Christians back in the first century enjoyed many spiritual blessings. But Jesus and the apostles foretold that true worship would be corrupted and lost. (Matthew 13:24-30; Acts 20:29,&nbsp;30) After the apostolic age, Christendom arose. Her clergymen adopted pagan teachings and practices. They also made approach to God all but impossible, painting him as an incomprehensible Trinity and teaching people to confess to priests and to pray to Mary and various “saints” instead of to Jehovah. Now, after many centuries of such corruption, what has Jehovah done? In the midst of today’s world—a world that is choked with religious falsehood and befouled with ungodly practices—he has stepped in and restored pure worship! Without exaggerating, we can say that this restoration is one of the most important developments in modern times.</P><P align="left">10</P><P align="left">True Christians today therefore enjoy a spiritual paradise. What does this paradise involve? Primarily, two elements. The first is the pure worship of the true God, Jehovah. He has blessed us with a way of worship that is free of lies and distortions. He has blessed us with spiritual food. This enables us to learn about our heavenly Father, to please him, and to draw close to him. (John 4:24) The second aspect of the spiritual paradise involves people. As Isaiah foretold, “in the final part of the days,” Jehovah has taught his worshipers the ways of peace. He has abolished warfare among us. Despite our imperfections, he helps us to put on “the new personality.” He blesses our efforts with his holy spirit, which produces beautiful fruitage in us. (Ephesians 4:22-24; Galatians 5:22,&nbsp;23) When you work in harmony with God’s spirit, you are truly part of the spiritual paradise.</P><P align="left">11</P><P align="left">Jehovah has gathered into this spiritual paradise the type of people that he loves—those who love him, who love peace, and who are “conscious of their spiritual need.” (Matthew 5:3) Such are the people who will be privileged to witness an even more spectacular restoration—that of mankind and of the entire earth.</P><P align="center">“Look!</P><P align="center"><STRONG>I</STRONG> <STRONG>Am</STRONG> <STRONG>Making</STRONG> <STRONG>All</STRONG> <STRONG>Things</STRONG> <STRONG>New”</STRONG></P><P align="left">12</P><P align="left">Many of the restoration prophecies call for more than a spiritual restoration. Isaiah, for example, wrote of a time when the sick, the lame, the blind, and the deaf would be healed and even death itself would be swallowed up forever. (Isaiah 25:8; 35:1-7) Such promises did not see a literal fulfillment in ancient Israel. And while we have seen a spiritual fulfillment of these promises in our day, there is every reason to believe that in the future, there will be a literal, full-scale fulfillment. How do we know that?</P><P align="left">13</P><P align="left">Back in Eden, Jehovah made clear his purpose for the earth: It was to be inhabited by a happy, healthy, united family of mankind. Man and woman were to care for the earth and all of its creatures, to turn the entire planet into a paradise. (Genesis 1:28) That is a far cry from the present state of affairs. Rest assured, though, that Jehovah’s purposes are never thwarted. (Isaiah 55:10,&nbsp;11) Jesus, as the Messianic King appointed by Jehovah, will bring about this global Paradise.—Luke 23:43.</P><P align="left">14</P><P align="left">Imagine seeing the whole earth turned into Paradise! Jehovah says of that time: “Look! I am making all things new.” (Revelation 21:5) Consider what that will mean. When Jehovah has finished wielding his destructive power against this wicked old system, there will remain “new heavens and a new earth.” This means that a new government will reign from heaven over a new earthly society composed of those who love Jehovah and who do his will. (2&nbsp;Peter 3:13) Satan, along with his demons, will be put out of commission. (Revelation 20:3) For the first time in thousands of years, mankind will be free of that corrupt, hateful, negative influence. The sense of relief will no doubt be overwhelming.</P><P align="left">15</P><P align="left">At last, we will be able to take care of this beautiful planet as we were originally meant to do. The earth has natural restorative powers. Polluted lakes and rivers can cleanse themselves if the source of the pollution is eliminated; battle-scarred landscapes can heal if the wars cease. What a pleasure it will be to work in harmony with the earth, helping to turn it into a gardenlike park, a global Eden of endless variety! Instead of wantonly wiping out animal and plant species, man will be at peace with all creation on earth. Even children will have nothing to fear from wild animals.—Isaiah 9:6,&nbsp;7; 11:1-9.</P><P align="left">16</P><P align="left">We will also experience restoration on a personal level. After Armageddon, the survivors will see miraculous healings on a global scale. As he did while on earth, Jesus will use his God-given power to restore sight to the blind, hearing to the deaf, soundness of body to the lame and infirm. (Matthew 15:30) The aged will delight in renewed youthful strength, health, and vigor. (Job 33:25) Wrinkles will vanish, limbs will straighten, and muscles will flex with renewed power. All of faithful mankind will sense that the effects of sin and imperfection are gradually diminishing, dropping away. How we will thank Jehovah God for his marvelous restorative power! Let us now focus on one especially heartwarming aspect of this thrilling time of restoration.</P><P align="center">Restoring</P><P align="center"><STRONG>Life</STRONG> <STRONG>to</STRONG> <STRONG>the</STRONG> <STRONG>Dead</STRONG></P><P align="left">17</P><P align="left">In the first century&nbsp;C.E., some religious leaders, called Sadducees, did not believe in the resurrection. Jesus reprimanded them with the words: “You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God.” (Matthew 22:29) Yes, the Scriptures reveal that Jehovah has such restorative power. How so?</P><P align="left">18</P><P align="left">Picture what happened in Elijah’s day. A widow was holding the limp body of her only child in her arms. The boy was dead. The prophet Elijah, who had been the widow’s guest for some time, must have been shocked. Earlier, he helped rescue this child from starvation. Elijah may well have grown attached to the little fellow. The mother was just heartbroken. This boy had been her only living reminder of her dead husband. She may have hoped that her son would care for her in her old age. Distraught, the widow feared that she was being punished for some past error. Elijah could not bear to see this tragedy thus compounded. He gently took the corpse from the mother’s bosom, carried it up to his room, and asked Jehovah God to restore the child’s soul, or life.—1&nbsp;Kings 17:8-21.</P><P align="left">19</P><P align="left">Elijah was not the first person to believe in the resurrection. Centuries earlier, Abraham believed that Jehovah has such restorative power—and for good reason. When Abraham was 100 years old and Sarah was 90, Jehovah restored their deadened reproductive powers, miraculously enabling Sarah to bear a son. (Genesis 17:17; 21:2,&nbsp;3) Later, when the boy was fully grown, Jehovah asked Abraham to sacrifice his son. Abraham showed faith, reckoning that Jehovah could restore his beloved Isaac to life. (Hebrews 11:17-19) Such intense faith may explain why Abraham, before ascending the mountain to offer up his son, assured his servants that he and Isaac would return together.—Genesis 22:5.</P><P align="left">20</P><P align="left">Jehovah spared Isaac, so there was no need for a resurrection at that time. In Elijah’s case, however, the widow’s son was already dead—but not for long. Jehovah rewarded the prophet’s faith by resurrecting the child! Elijah then handed the boy over to his mother, with these unforgettable words: “See, your son is alive”!—1&nbsp;Kings 17:22-24.</P><P align="left">21</P><P align="left">Thus for the first time in the Bible record, we see Jehovah using his power to restore a human life. Later, Jehovah also empowered Elisha, Jesus, Paul, and Peter to restore the dead to life. Of course, those who were resurrected eventually died again. Nonetheless, such Bible accounts give us a wonderful preview of things to come.</P><P align="left">22</P><P align="left">In Paradise, Jesus will fulfill his role as “the resurrection and the life.” (John 11:25) He will resurrect countless millions, giving them an opportunity to live forever in Paradise on earth. (John 5:28,&nbsp;29) Imagine the reunions as beloved friends and relatives, long separated by death, embrace one another, quite beside themselves with joy! All mankind will praise Jehovah for his restorative power.</P><P align="left">23</P><P align="left">Jehovah has furnished a rock-solid guarantee that such hopes are secure. In the greatest of all demonstrations of his power, he resurrected his Son, Jesus, as a mighty spirit creature, making him second only to Jehovah. The resurrected Jesus appeared to hundreds of eyewitnesses. (1&nbsp;Corinthians 15:5,&nbsp;6) Even for skeptics, such evidence should be ample. Jehovah has the power to restore life.</P><P align="left">24</P><P align="left">Not only does Jehovah have the power to restore the dead but he also has the desire to do so. The faithful man Job was inspired to say that Jehovah actually <EM>yearns</EM> to bring back the dead. (Job 14:15) Are you not drawn to our God, who is eager to use his restorative power in such a loving way? Remember, though, that the resurrection is but one aspect of Jehovah’s great restoration work ahead. As you draw ever closer to him, always cherish the precious hope that you can be there to see Jehovah “making all things new.”—Revelation 21:5.</P><P align="left">[Footnotes]</P><P align="left">“The times of restoration of all things” began when the Messianic Kingdom was established with an heir of faithful King David on the throne. Jehovah had promised David that an heir of his would rule forever. (Psalm 89:35-37) But after Babylon destroyed Jerusalem in 607&nbsp;B.C.E., no human descendant of David sat on God’s throne. Jesus, who was born on earth as an heir of David, became the long-promised King when he was enthroned in heaven.</P><P align="left">For example, Moses, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Micah, and Zephaniah all developed this theme.</P> Thu, 12 Jun 2014 21:44:34 GMT **bustysinclaire** 2014-06-12T21:44:34Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3264919#M128075 <P>I'm not here to trample all over people's faith/beliefs but to ask if/why such beliefs should hold such high value in our society?</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>So where am I comming from? Well we can freely question almost anything in our society/lives; morals, political beliefs, actions and reactions, motivations, interactions, foreign policy, education, welfare, how we raise our children, law and order and so on..........</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>However we are positively discouraged from questioning people's faith/beliefs/religion! We are also actively encouraged to accommodate and allow for people's religious beliefs, and this is the bit that really irks me! Why is it that if something is done in the name of a religious belief/practice then we are expected to accept it with little fuss where if any other excuse were used we'd be up in arms?</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>We endure arguments of whether animal rights should take precedence over religion, whether saving the life of a child should take precedence over their parent's beliefs, should freedom of expression take precedence over religious sensitivities?</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>For me you may as well base stuff on the football team you support;</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>"I can't comply with the company dress code because I'm a United fan and therefore I must be allowed to wear a United shirt at work."</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>As far as I'm concerned this is no more ridiculous than anything done/not done in the name of religious beliefs!</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>So why do religious beliefs hold such high status and is it right that they do?</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>&nbsp;</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 09:24:10 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3264919#M128075 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T09:24:10Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3264985#M128076 <P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">No it's not right. As to why they hold such "high value" in our society it's because <STRONG>we</STRONG> are tolerant, quite the opposite to most religions!</FONT></P><P>&nbsp;</P><P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">If some group believed the Moon is made of Green Cheese, would it be right that they stone to death anyone who questioned their belief?</FONT></P><P>&nbsp;</P><P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">A ridiculous comparison? No, it's not. I say if the Paradise some groups believe in is so wonderful, why don't they all clear off there now and leave the rest of us alone?</FONT></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 09:39:41 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3264985#M128076 cee-dee 2014-06-11T09:39:41Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265161#M128083 <P><SPAN>"No it's not right. As to why they hold such "high value" in our society it's because&nbsp;</SPAN><STRONG>we</STRONG><SPAN>&nbsp;are tolerant, quite the opposite to most religions!"</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>But this is not a question of our tolerence of different religions versus the tolerence those of certain beliefs show to us/others. The question is whether any religion should be tolerated to the extent it is?</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>I believe we should tolerate religious beliefs but no more than we tolerate people supporting different football teams! People can go worship what they want but as soon as they expect others to bend to their whims I believe they should expect those whims to be quashed!</SPAN></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 10:20:39 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265161#M128083 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T10:20:39Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265355#M128088 Unfortunately if you try &amp; debate on this subject you get accused of bullying or being flippant ! Wed, 11 Jun 2014 10:57:36 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265355#M128088 saasher2012 2014-06-11T10:57:36Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265571#M128089 <P>It doesn't matter what a person's personal beliefs ot how whacky they may be as long as they keep those beliefs to themselves and don't try to mess up the lives of others.</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>A classic example was the attempted stopping of a Sunday ferry service between Lewis and Stornaway on the grounds of it being the Sabbath.</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>And of course they don't try to teach children ignorance and how to have a closed mind.</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 11:47:41 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265571#M128089 bankhaunter 2014-06-11T11:47:41Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265599#M128090 <P>Ohhhhh,, mmm i was going to say i think this thread could be a bit risky and cause confrontation, eeek.<img id="womanindifferent" class="emoticon emoticon-womanindifferent" src="https://community.ebay.co.uk/i/smilies/16x16_woman-indifferent.png" alt="Woman Indifferent" title="Woman Indifferent" /></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 11:54:55 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265599#M128090 rose2008-2008 2014-06-11T11:54:55Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265607#M128092 <P>Religion is control, it makes you do what is deemed to be right; for fear of going to hell. It makes you ahere to an ethos laid down by others for the same reason. It can make you kill your fellow human beings, because some religions can be twisted to justify doing just that. Finally, to show its total idiocy, two sides will go to war..........shouting praise to the same God...........ridiculous !!</P><P>Give me a human being who does the right thing, because THEY believe it to be right; NOT because some religion, or even a law, has told them it is right.</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 11:56:55 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265607#M128092 evoman3957 2014-06-11T11:56:55Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265771#M128094 <P>"<SPAN>Give me a human being who does the right thing, because THEY believe it to be right; NOT because some religion, or even a law, has told them it is right."</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>Amen to that!</SPAN></P><P>&nbsp;</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 12:24:39 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265771#M128094 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T12:24:39Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265953#M128097 <P><STRONG>Give me a human being who does the right thing, because THEY believe it to be right; NOT because some religion, or even a law, has told them it is right.</STRONG></P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>I suspect that the majority of those who practice a religion do just that and in order to do so either don't know about or deliberately ignore the somewhat more dubious morallity their religion actually preaches.</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>Religions can be a force for good, the Quakers for example did well in business because although they could be tough negociators they were very trustworthy, their word really was their bond, they probably didn't need a god to behave like that though but it would remind them of their purpose.</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>Nothing more annoys me than to be told that without the Bible no one can have any morals, as though the Ten Commandments weren't a bit late on the moral laws stage, there being others long before them.</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>I don't think a person should be respected for no better reason than they hold a position in a church, they are no different than anyone else.</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:04:58 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265953#M128097 bankhaunter 2014-06-11T13:04:58Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265985#M128098 <P>"<SPAN>Nothing more annoys me than to be told that without the Bible no one can have any morals, as though the Ten Commandments weren't a bit late on the moral laws stage, there being others long before them."</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>And Amen to that too!</SPAN></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:10:16 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3265985#M128098 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T13:10:16Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266047#M128099 <P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">Well now, there were supposed to be 613 (although even that is open to argument).</FONT></P><P>&nbsp;</P><P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">The 10 Commandments were the result of a bit of pruning, much as all the Holy books have?</FONT></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:27:41 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266047#M128099 cee-dee 2014-06-11T13:27:41Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266061#M128101 Several of these so called commandments have now been broken by the so called leaders in the Church hierarchy , so as to accommodate themselves &amp; the changing society !. Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:31:11 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266061#M128101 saasher2012 2014-06-11T13:31:11Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266137#M128103 <P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">The people who firmly "believe" won't enter in to any rational discussion on the subject and in some countries any attempt to do so might prove fatal?</FONT></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:41:21 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266137#M128103 cee-dee 2014-06-11T13:41:21Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266219#M128107 Is that I wonder because they are so sure of their faith or because they are frightened it may be proved to be false<BR />If you try to ask pertinent questions you always seem to get fobbed off or as I stated before you are accused of bullying ?<BR />In a lot of countries you are not allowed the freedom to ask questions , I'm afraid ours is fast becoming the same!. Wed, 11 Jun 2014 13:55:55 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266219#M128107 saasher2012 2014-06-11T13:55:55Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266251#M128109 <P><FONT face="comic sans ms,sans-serif" color="#00FF00" size="4">I did believe in God when i was younger,, really because i thought i had too coming from a Bible bashing family!!. But as i have got older and more cynical i dont believe in God but i think there has got to be something at work,,,deciding things and our fates and terrible things that go on in the world. And good things too i suppose.<img id="womanindifferent" class="emoticon emoticon-womanindifferent" src="https://community.ebay.co.uk/i/smilies/16x16_woman-indifferent.png" alt="Woman Indifferent" title="Woman Indifferent" /></FONT></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 14:02:42 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266251#M128109 rose2008-2008 2014-06-11T14:02:42Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266293#M128112 Hmmmm, the Rev. Paul Flowers comes to mind.....he held a prominent position in the Methodist Church! And almost brought down a big Bank! Drug taking, rent boys.......what a hypocrite! Wed, 11 Jun 2014 14:12:31 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266293#M128112 astrologica 2014-06-11T14:12:31Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266325#M128113 I really like Lambsy's point about being a United fan! That's a good post Lambsy's...and food for thought. Wed, 11 Jun 2014 14:16:32 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266325#M128113 astrologica 2014-06-11T14:16:32Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266343#M128114 <P>"<SPAN>The people who firmly "believe" won't enter in to any rational discussion on the subject and in some countries any attempt to do so might prove fatal?"</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>But I don't wish to deter them from their beliefs, I just want a reason why their beliefs or practices should take prcedence over all else!</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>I don't want to say "you believe in what?, you're having a laugh."</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>But I should be able to comfortably say "I'm sorry if our dress code/uniform policy clashes with you religious beliefs/practices but I'm afraid that's just the way it is and you will have to accept it because our policy takes precedence!</SPAN></P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>Or "I'm sorry our health and safety or working practices clash with your religious practices but health and safety and operational procedure take precedence"!</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>Or "I'm sorry if our consideration for Animal Rights clashes with you religious practices but animal welfare takes precedence"!</P><P>&nbsp;</P><P>Or "I'm sorry if our working/opening hours upset you because they clash with you Sabath but we will not be taking this into consideration when scheduling."</P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 14:20:51 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266343#M128114 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T14:20:51Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266513#M128115 <P><FONT face="book antiqua,palatino" color="#0000FF" size="3">You won't deter them from their beliefs because they won't even enter in to a rational discussion!</FONT></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 15:12:17 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266513#M128115 cee-dee 2014-06-11T15:12:17Z https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266557#M128117 <P>"<SPAN>You won't deter them from their beliefs because they won't even enter in to a rational discussion!"</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>&nbsp;</SPAN></P><P><SPAN>As I said; I don't wish to deter them from their beliefs, just to understand that they do not take precedence over other considerations!</SPAN></P> Wed, 11 Jun 2014 15:23:58 GMT https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/The-Round-Table/Should-Faith-Religion-Have-Such-a-High-Value-In-Our-Society/m-p/3266557#M128117 lambsy_uk 2014-06-11T15:23:58Z